Could HIM have reached bigger success?

[SIRJARVIS01]

I find it a little odd that from album to album, starting at RR To Dark Light specifically, HIM seemed to be all over the radar...I firmly believe there weren't enough of the "right people" behind this band or the band was just too scared to take a leap of faith [eg. when they fired Andy Wallace] or the whole DSABH era....they always seem to stick to predictable sounds even though Ville is always promising something new, it never really is...every album kind of transitions into the next (as far as the way they're recorded in the studio) Live however is a totally different story. these guys can try any live sound and make it work! It's sad because when I hear the Vinnfox Relics, I hear what other albums couldve sounded like (Dark Light with a Vinnfox Relics setup wouldve been killer

Maybe Ville and the guys were just too stubborn?
What do you all think?

[Jay]

I've felt the same. It's like Love Metal should have taken them to new heights but didn't. I remember thinking when they played the tour with Linkin Park, who were massive at the time,that they were going to blow up.

Then again when MTV2 in the US played their concert and hyped them up just before Dark Light.

I'm not sure what it was, though. We never got the "Sabbath" sounding record Ville promised us, but after the third time, we knew better.

[SIRJARVIS01]

To be totally honest, A lot of it has to do with the way Tim Palmer produced and mixed the albums starting with LM. He did a great job on the Live DVD at the orpheum, BUT he still couldve added a bit more life to the mix....it's like they were too scared to try anything else

[616]

my answer to the thread question is  -  no
it has nothing to do with producers and stuff but the music genre and style in general. They started in the last possible time of this era - you must look at the mainstream music. They were lucky that they started not a year later because if you look how the pop music changed over the last 20 years, its a miracle for a rock band to achieve what HIM achieved. Other rock bands are bigger because of the names and their golden age. Every band has its peak. GNS in early 90s, Nirvana when they were active. Besides that you dont see U2 on MTV anymore, only at classic hits on VH1 and you wnt hear it on the radio , only rock radios.
The wave that beats hitparades and sales now is stuff like Justin Bieber or other crap. All the other bands , old bands are just living off their name because they were once "biebers" of their era. HIM started right in time, their peak was RR really in Europe, since Love Metal their popularity is decreasing due the music marketing and mainstream interests. Yeah Dark Light was succesful, but in US as it was new and it also affected Europe as well, but in general they were more popular in RR - DSBH era
And since then Hip Hop, Rap came to the mode, so the target audience was not interested in some rock music but in the music that was "cool"
it changes.
HIM as a band was a very succesful band, very lucky that they have a huge fanbase and they really made a lot of great music and of course they became rich and they dont have to do anything in the future anymore. Just enjoying their time, not to worry about work , no stress.
Even if you read Synnin Viemaa, they had a lot of luck. For example Join me, probably their breaking hit that started general European interest was picked by the label as a single - and it worked so fucking great on the audience. Ville said that the song is shit and they would not pick it as a single. It barely got on the album
The same with ROTWOAB ...... THey meant to put out Dark Light song as a first single. Well coincidence is sometimes pretty generous. They screwed it in 2007 with Kiss of Dawn in my opinion and later with Heartkiller.... totally radio unfriendly songs in the era of what was cool , so it was not succesful.

[SIRJARVIS01]

@616

i SEE WHAT YOU'RE SAYING ABOUT THE TIME PERIOD, HOWEVER YOU GOTTA LOOK IN BETWEEN THE LINES AS WELL. dARK lIGHT WAS SUPPOSED TO BE THEIR BLOWUP ALBUM AND IN A WAY IT WAS. BUT, I ALSO FEEL IF VILLE HADNT BEEN DRINKING AS MUCH, IT WOULDN'T HAVE HALTED AS MUCH PROGRESS WHICH I BELIEVE IS SOMEWHAT WHAT HAPPENED.....THEY WENT FROM MAKING ALBUMS EVER YEAR AND A HALF TO 2 YEARS APART, THEN 3, NOW IT'S BEEN ONLY 3 IN THE LAST 10 YEARS.....AGAIN SORRY FOR THE CAPS LOCK

[Jay]

@616 Hit it. If HIM debuted today, they wouldn't be anywhere near as successful. Most music today is forgettable. It's all pop shit looking to sell something. It's all so generic.  Does anyone seek out full albums anymore or just singles? I get that with technology today everyone wants everything right now.

I'm not sure that drinking or whatever affected much other than tours. Their live shows started off amazing but in the last few years they haven't been much to write about.

[SIRJARVIS01]

I think it also has a lot to do with the fact that there old music didn't get promoted in the US and other territories until the Dark light era, which is why I strongly believe that they really messed up when they fired a producer that could have helped them Reach New Heights to be totally honest they're always speaking about how every album differs from the other in terms of tone and sound but at the end of the day it all sounds more of the same. I feel like they were too afraid to try something completely new which is quite funny because before Tears On Tape came out we were promised that the band was going to return to its roots and now I can't seem to tell the difference between love metal dark light and Tears On Tape sound-wise

[666WTLOnVinylFTW]

Chris Isaak. John Fryer. Bam Margera.

You know what I'm sayin'?

[SIRJARVIS01]

John fryer should have done every album after RE

[krush]

I feel like they screwed their careers with SWRMXS.  They weren't big enough to afford the throwaway record loophole, and should have stayed at Warner. 

The only reason I read about the forced split was that the execs on Sire with them from the beginning had left, so they felt like they were on a label with people they didn't know. So?  They could have made new friends.  They could have just made another proper record and see where that would take them.  Maybe they would have gotten another Sire deal, maybe another major label would have made them an offer.  If they had the power to fire a producer for sounding "too American", surely they didn't have it that bad.

Ville blames ToT's commercial failure on "nobody liked it lol".  That's bullshit.  Nobody knew it existed because you released it on indie labels with next-to-nothing promotion.

[Zhivago]

They were unwilling to promote it themselves. In one of the few online interviews from then, Ville said they didn't need to because of the internet. The fans would get the word out. Such nonsense.

[Inferno]

It's possible... But then again I don't know if there's even that many more people that they would have garnered as fans if they actually got off their ass and did some promotion. I definitely think they were piss poor in that regard and missed out on a lot of eyes because of that, but I also have to take a step back and realize that their music, as a genre, isn't as popular as others and even more so in the US in my opinion.

[SIRJARVIS01]

well, I believe it was possible. Well, when you put it that way, it also depends during which era should they have "got off their asses" so to speak as Inferno put it. I for one believe they should have done more promotion during the dark light era because during that time, they were starting out in a whole other mainstream country, just like they did during the RR tour back in 2000.

It's possible... But then again I don't know if there's even that many more people that they would have garnered as fans if they actually got off their ass and did some promotion. I definitely think they were piss poor in that regard and missed out on a lot of eyes because of that, but I also have to take a step back and realize that their music, as a genre, isn't as popular as others and even more so in the US in my opinion.

[Inferno]

well, I believe it was possible. Well, when you put it that way, it also depends during which era should they have "got off their asses" so to speak as Inferno put it. I for one believe they should have done more promotion during the dark light era because during that time, they were starting out in a whole other mainstream country, just like they did during the RR tour back in 2000.

It's possible... But then again I don't know if there's even that many more people that they would have garnered as fans if they actually got off their ass and did some promotion. I definitely think they were piss poor in that regard and missed out on a lot of eyes because of that, but I also have to take a step back and realize that their music, as a genre, isn't as popular as others and even more so in the US in my opinion.

I agree about the timing, but DL was actually advertised/marketed quite well which is why it did so good in the states... it was everything else that wasn't. They needed to keep pushing everything from Venus Doom onward.

[SIRJARVIS01]

thats very true, VD wasn't a good follow up commercially. Besides that, the follow up to DL suffered a bit due to Ville's alcoholism.